Our founder Elizabeth Ansell joined Dr. Katie Peters on the Brain & Life Podcast for a two-part conversation about ME/CFS, medical validation, and why the patient community has been ahead of the curve on post-viral illness for decades.

In Part One (Episode 173), Elizabeth shared something that has stayed with her since her diagnostic journey, a moment when a nurse practitioner told her that normal test results don’t mean anything is wrong. They mean we’re running the wrong tests, or the right ones haven’t been invented yet. That reframe meant everything. It’s what so many in the ME/CFS community have needed to hear, and rarely do.

In Part Two (Episode 174), the conversation went deeper into the relationship between ME/CFS and Long COVID, and why it shouldn’t be surprising that the two overlap so significantly. As Elizabeth noted on the podcast: with viral outbreaks, a certain percentage of people simply don’t recover. As many as 45% of people with long COVID fit the case definition for ME/CFS. These are post-viral illnesses. We need to study them together.

The ME/CFS community has been saying this for years. Decades, really. Long COVID didn’t reveal a new phenomenon. It put a spotlight on one we’d been living inside of all along.

Both episodes are available now on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.